Almost everything (and everything we are going to use) with Pathfinder is contained in the Pathfinder Reference Document (PRD). This is similar to the SRD for 3.X, except it is vastly more informative: Pathfinder splatbooks are part of this.
This is convenient for two reasons. The one of lesser importance is that it doesn't cost anything to have the book you, personally, need. Because you can all afford quite a few 20-40 dollar books, should the need arise, this is not that important. The bigger one is that speech about the mechanics is not limited. You can quote an entire base class should you need, discuss, edit. No need for being concerned with "fair use" and worrying about some fucking corporate lawyer sending a DMCA takedown to the ISP. We can talk openly about our nerdery!

The campaign I plan to run is "P6"- Pathfinder E6. This will take place in Caligo, and it will be after the events of the prior campaign. Narso will not be involved, but I may be lying about that. Because we don't have a subforum for this (and I don't have much to put in there anyway), restrict posts to this thread for the time being.

I will be applying several houserules. Most of these will be for the purpose of campaign compliance (Caligo has Dark Knights, Nilaks, and Tura gems). A few will be some houserules that we will import from 3.X, but I will try to minimize these (I plan to bring in our excellent armor and shield work, for instance, but we will play Quicken Spell and missile weapons by stock rules, nor will I have a list of compressed double feats to confuse you). There will also be a couple tweaks for E6 (capstone feats, cone of cold as 3rd level, etc.), but these should be the ones you are familiar with. The big point is, I am going to try to run way closer to stock than before: the prior houserules were meant to fix serious issues in 3.X over the course of many years, and we shouldn't assume we will need them in Pathfinder.


Automatically allowed races:
Human
Elf, High (standard elf)
Elf, Wood (use "savage elf") EDIT: I have a custom elf here, +2 Dex +2 Wis -2 Con, Woodcraft instead of Elven Magic.
Elf, Gray (use "tower elf") EDIT: I have a custom elf here, +2 Dex +2 Int -2 Str -2 Con, more elfyspecials.
Dwarf
Half-Elf
Half-Orc
Orc
Gnomes (!)
Nilak
Dhampir
Hobgoblin
Kitsune
Sylrenan
Sylrenan, Keichi-blooded


Can't promise but will try:
Goblin
Tengu
Merfolk

Others: ask, any character native to Caligo or Tanna should exist, as well as a few others. My big concern is with the power level of E6.


Remember that I expect the party to generally be able to walk into a town without looking like a bunch of pokemon, but if you want to be dicks I can roll with that too.



Notes on classes:
In pathfinder, your "favored class" is more meaningful. When you level and choose a level of your favored class, you can choose between gaining a skill point, or a hit point. The advanced rules have a bunch more options for this choice, but we aren't playing with those pages of optional rules- you are limited to a skill point, or a hit point. The hit point is generally more favored. A side effect of this is that prestige classes are deemphasized (they are particularly lame in E6 anyway). To help customize your character, pathfinder has a bunch of "archetypes", which are basically like 2ed "kits"- you choose them at character creation, and they give you different bonuses as you level. I haven't gone through and made any lists, but assume that a decent number of these will be allowed, so ask if you are looking for a certain archetype. I will freely disqualify the ones of these that are too powerful in my judgment.


Allowed Classes (links are to a third party site, you can also go to http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ for a more elegant layout but less links )

Purely martial classes:
Barbarian ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/unchain ... -unchained )
The barbarian is available to anyone from an uncivilized area, and relies on strength and vigor to fight, supplemented by their iconic rage.
Cavalier ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/cavalier )
Masters of steeds and solo combat, cavaliers inspire their teammates and gain minor powers depending on the order they choose.
Fighter ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/fighter )
Every society more advanced than a roaming tribe has fighters, the greatest warriors of their ilk, trained in weapons and armor.
Gunsligner ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/gunslinger )
The gunslinger relies on luck and bullshit armor ignoring mechanics to be a powerful short ranged combatant.
Rogue (use Unchained Rogue http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/unchain ... -unchained )
Slippery in combat and in society, rogues are exactly what you hope them to be.
Samurai ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/alterna ... es/samurai )
The greatest solo combatants of Pallia, the samurai normally swear service to a feudal lord. They are mechanically similar to the cavalier.


Ki-empowered martial classes:
Kuromeran Ninja ( Probably using http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/unchain ... ined-ninja )
Trained in the south of Pallia, Kuromeran ninja schools emphasize stealth and trickery, and are mechanically similar to rogues.
Monk ( I think we are using http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/unchain ... -unchained , probably)
The monk's mastery of enshindo enables him to fight in mystical fashion. You all know the monk! He's the monkest.
Zeugeran Ninja ( tbd )
Trained in the north of Pallia, Zeugeran ninja schools emphasize mystic powers, and are mechanically more similar to monks


Hybrid martial / divine classes:
Dark Knight ( tbd )
A divine warrior willing to channel negative energy for power, the dark knight is the same one you've seen, but I still need to port him (LN, LE)
Inquisitor ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/inquisitor )
Trained to lead holy raids in the service of the church, the inquisitor lacks the might of the paladin, but has a lot of teamwork and synergy.
Paladin ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/paladin )
Lawful good and willing to lecture you, the paladin specializes in shoving law and order into whatever orifice needs it most.
Ranger ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/ranger )
The lightly armored but damage heavy wilderness warrior, the ranger can draw a few spells from nature.

Hybrid martial / arcane classes:
Alchemist ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist )
Alchemists can make bombs, temporary drink a Hyde potion, and create drinkable buffs each day.
Bard ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/bard )
A Bard's mind isn't barred. A bards mindisnt barred a bardsmind isntbarred abardsmindisntbarred bardbardmindbardbarredbard
bard bard bard, bard is a wahhrd
Magus ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus )
A fully trained warrior with some decent magic, the magus relies on memorized touch spells to burst down his foes.

Divine classes:
Channeler ( Pathfinder's Oracle: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/oracle )
A normally lone agent of a concept or deity, the channeler is cursed and blessed in equal measure. A spontaneous divine caster.
Cleric ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric )
Modified from 3.X (medium armor, different channeling), the cleric remains the agent of his god.
Druid ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/druid )
With a strong animal companion and a set of nature magic, the druid speaks for the trees, and fucks things up for them too.

Arcane classes:
Sorcerer ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer )
Born this way
Summoner (use http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/unchain ... -unchained )
With a manifested fragment of an extraplanar being, the summoner brings less magic than the other arcanists. A spontaneous arcane caster.
Witch ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/witch )
A full powered prepared arcane caster like the wizard, the witch does not have the breadth of spells to cast, but is trained with reusable hexes.
Wizard ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard )
The wizard is the fucking best, of course.

Psionic classes:
Psychic ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventur ... es/psychic )
A replacement for the psion, the psychic is a full caster in the style of a sorcerer, but with a smaller spell list that is disjoint from the other full casters.
Kineticist ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventur ... kineticist )
With a tie to an element, the kineticist can endlessly generate elemental blasts, as well as having access to utility powers.
Spiritualist ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventur ... iritualist )
A powerful phantom and a decent selection of weak cleric and wizard spells means that the spiritualist will not lack for actions and abilities.


If you see class you are curious about ask. If you are interested in an archetype, ask.

Also, there are supposed to be elemental mages, but I was having problems with them before the switch to Pathfinder. I'll try to get some better documents in a few months. I'll definitely have dark knights and the Z. ninja, and hopefully the elemental guys too.

I couldn't find any reference to these races, can you elaborate or provide a link?
Nilak
Sylrenan
Sylrenan, Keichi-blooded


Also I LOLed at walking into town looking like a bunch of Pokemon.

My initial interests with about 5 minutes spent on it...

Cavalier
Rogue
Inquisitor
Paladin
Kineticist
Spiritualist

I am very interested in being a merfolk because I want to flop around.

Is this a high priority, or are you just curious? I will have full specials at a later date, but an overview with stats:

The Nilaks are about as tall as a shorter elf or a taller dwarf, with grayish skin, and are generally uninterested in violence, glory, or cities. Their faces are humanlike, but with a few mild feral features at times. They normally live in areas considered not worth warring for, and usually work enough to live in acceptable conditions. They've been in every campaign world I've ever made, and you even saved a village of them in the last campaign. They are foolish but likable. They are also dextrous and have a prehensile tail. Almost all Nilaks are true neutral. Library sources say that they were originally migrants from the mythical Tanna, the supposed origin point of many Caligan races. Nilaks are usually agnostic, which is commendable when your race was provably saved by divine action.

The Sylrenan claim to have come from a magical book in a past Age. They are frailer than humans, but almost as diverse. Sylrenans have a bonus to either Int or Wis, and to either Str or Dex. The Sylrenan mostly live among humans, but have no taste for war with other mortal races.

Keichi-blooded Sylrenan claim distant descent from an ancient human hero, which is impossible as humans and Sylrenans cannot interbreed. They have the same stat allocation as humans (+2 to any one stat), but otherwise resemble other Sylrenans.


Races have special abilities in Pathfinder, just as in D&D, and I still need to work those out precisely.

You'd probably have to be a strongtailed merman or merchick to be an adventurer (as in, both types exist, but the ones with a move of 5' / swim 50' will probably not be available as an adventurer no matter what, meaning you'll have a move of 15' / swim 30'). I need to access that race guide to be sure.

Definitely paladin merfolk then. I have always wanted my inability to move quickly to be my primary reason for never fleeing a fight. Also, I want to lay on flippers.

Excellent. Your charge will be 20 feet in plate. You'll want a mount at character creation, and you will be a true joy in dungeons, flopping about hither and thither. Figure out how you are gonna saddle a fucking pony, stat. Also, you definitely cannot wear any form of magical shoe.

APPARENTLY Zem was only kidding. Merfolk paladin is still up for grabs.

Some core differences in Pathfinder:

Skills are compressed. This means that there are not nearly as many skills in Pathfinder as in 3.X. Perception stands in for Listen and Spot. Stealth stands in for Hide and Move Silently. Jump, Climb, and Balance become Athletics. Etc.

Skill points are reduced. At 1st level, you gain your normal allotment of skill points- no quadrupling. Your max ranks in a skill is equal to your level.

Class skills means a different thing. If you have even a single rank in a class skill, you get a +3 bonus to that skill.
EDIT: I previously stated that buying a cross class skill still costs two. It does not, it only costs 1. Basically, someone fully trained in a class skill will have +3 compared to someone fully trained in that same skill cross class, and each skill point allocation costs one skill point that you learned from leveling up.

So in 3.X, if you wanted to max spellcraft at 1st level as a wizard, you would spend 4 skill points in spellcraft. In Pathfinder, you have one quarter the skill points, but putting a single point in spellcraft gives you a +4 to it.


Hit dice are almost completely uniform. Anyone with a 1/2 BAB progression (pure casters, like the wizard) gets a d6. Anyone with 3/4 BAB progression (rogues, clerics, monks, etc) gets a d8. Anyone with full BAB progression (fighters, paladins, rangers) gets a d10. The only exception is barbarians, who get a d12. I think they wanted to normalize it, but no one wanted to tell the barbarians, so they keep it. Nobody runs around with a d4 hit die and their dick in their hand. This, combined with many characters choosing the extra hit point when they level, means that hit points are inflated compared to 3.X stock. Since almost everyone in 3.X boosts HP in some manner or other, this seems like a wise change.

Combat maneuvers. When you generate and level your characters, you will also update your Combat Maneuver Bonus (CMB, the offensive one) and Combat Maneuver Defense (CMD, the defensive one). This extra work makes trips, grapples, disarms, etc., way hella easier. Your CMB is your BAB plus your strength. Your CMD is 10 plus your strength plus your dexterity, plus some magical AC bonuses. This turns these from opposed rolls into a roll versus CMD, much like a to-hit roll. If someone tries to trip you, your CMD is right next to your AC, and the trip resolves normally, instead of having to pull up some junk. Meanwhile, a feat that makes you better at tripping is recorded next to your CMB so you know that doing than maneuver gets a bonus.

Races normally average out to +2 with their modifiers. With humans, this is +2 to any stat. With other races, this is +2 to two stats and -2 to one stat. Some races exceed or fall behind on this, but these are not the common races.

Other parts of the game are redone a bit too, and you'll see that as you look up those parts (feats, spells, class abilities).


I feel the biggest change is that every class gets something reasonably useful at every level, and that most class abilities have had something minor added to them. For instance, the barbarian rage gets "rage powers", which augment the rage, usually adding situational utility, or small amounts of single use damage.

I assume there are Pathfinder-specific character sheets we can use?

Now I want to be a sexy mermaid bard who keeps trading away instruments for crappy deals and bangs princes.



Ok, my choice is largely dependent on the others. I'd rather have them pick classes before I do. Then I can fill in where necessary. If Sweetcheeks picks wizard and the other go heavy melee, then I might consider a psionicist. If we're weak on melee, I'll go for a paladin or something. If we absolutely need some form of healing, I might consider... I don't know. Maybe.

Plenty of places. There are official ones, and there's stuff like:
http://charactersheets.minotaur.cc/


I mean, that's fine. But I think that kind of will be everyone else's answer too. The way we have normally built groups is, everyone sort of says what they want, and then the group kind of lands on a mostly balanced party as a result. The DM normally helps indirectly by making a few NPCs to choose from that the PCs end up steering, but I don't think that's strictly necessary. There's other ways- everyone can just put together whatever the hell they want, or the group can actually meet and decide on a specific group meant to achieve certain goals, or the DM can say something like "ok, this is a campaign about wizards, so you should all be wizards". Basically, make a party that is effective, or you will all die, and fun, because that is why everyone is here.

Now I kind of want to play a merman paladin. I only want this so I can A) Create the merfolk civilization in your world to some extend and B) Make everyone so sick of sea puns and expressions that they never do them again.

You sea, it begins with the obvious sort of thing. The tides have turned! With fronds like these, who needs anemones? But then I get to combine fantasy shit into it. "This rod can't be reel!" I can change all common expressions. "A sinking stone gathers no algae." I'd let others play because I wouldn't want to be shelfish. For the entire campaign I'd have to make sure I don't scale back the puns, but the DM might get crabby.

But there are concerns. This group is so punnish that I'd worry I'd become somebody else's prawn. And outfitting a merman paladin would be tricky... I don't even know what capsize they wear.

In case you're wondering... I guess it's just for the halibut.

------USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST------

Merman aside, I forgot I have effectively played a paladin before. Not mechanically, but I played a guy who very much wanted to be one but just wasn't wise enough. I thought that was a fun character.

So here are some options for me. These vary between not-even-remotely-close-to-full-backstory to so-I-suppose-I-could-play-a-class.

Steve (not really, but for now) was the son of a priest, and at a the proper age he joined the army. He did well in training and was sent to combat units, but he never truly saw much combat. When he was in the 5th infantry, they sent in the 3rd. When he was send into combat, he was never in a position to do much more than hold a shield wall. So he certainly felt the fear of death and buried many dear friends, but he rarely did his sword enter the fray. He married a lovely young woman and had several children. He didn't necessarily get to see his children very much since he had made a career of the army, but he loved them very much. Eventually his children made him a grandfather around the time he finally retired. He was just a little over 40 years old and very capable, but after 25 years in the army, they forced him to retire. He had made the rank of captain, which is what his little grandchildren called him. He spent his days helping out with them. Then, he received a message from his father's temple that he had died. Looking at the generations before and after, this triggered something within Steve. He did not feel that he had accomplished all he wanted to in this life, and he needed to do something. He either A) Turned to the church of his father and used his skills to become a paladin, or B) he became a cleric (less likely). This is different for me because I have pretty much always played someone without a family at all who was generally young.


Hank was raised in the slums of City John. He had many siblings, but his father was not a particularly gifted potter, so money was very tight. Hank was bullied a bit since he was a smaller child in the neighborhood, and he found comfort in the shadows. He climbed walls and hid in the spaces no one even knew existed. This was just how he coped. From one of his hidden perches he spotted some other fellows climbing into windows and taking what they wanted. Since he was usually hungry, realizing this was wrong was far less relevance than the convenience of having things. Eventually Hank made his way to Orange Gang and became a successful thief, primarily sneaking into homes at night. Unfortunately, Orange Gang was wiped out (rival gang or some law enforcement), and Hank was alone so far as he knew. He had his family, of course, but they had all taken honest professions and he did not want to go back to them. In some ways, Hank felt better without the Orange Gang because, well, they were definitely a bit more violent than suited him. I have never played a straight rogue before.


I can always do Ranger or Druid. Those are fun.

I could even consider a bard, but, honestly... even if they mathematically contribute well to the battle, it never FEELS like they do.

Crossposting, because I forgot about this thread.



My Pathfinder Core Rules book arrived! Yay!

Looking at classes...thinking maybe barbarian if no one else is playing a tank. I know I just tanked, but this could still be fun. A little sad that I'm not getting the "full barbarian experience" since this is E6, but I think it could still be fun. What are my options in the Donut World aside from what's in the book? If nothing else, maybe a half-orc barbarian....

If not a tank, maybe druid.

Of interest to a barbarian player may be the orc.

Definitely allowed archetypes:

Barbarians from the Teryeal Jungles are likely to have this archetype
The elemental-kin have no stronger tie to the elements of Caligo than their kinsmen, but are blessed at birth to use elemental damage to fuel their rage
Fauna in Poloss grow to massive size under the light of the First Moon, and the tribesmen train in groups against such large creatures
Tribesmen of the Voriphan Isles have no large land game to run down, and have focused on ranged weaponry to help hunt large birds and fish

I don't have any custom rage powers at this time to add, but I will be making sure that a capstone feat can treat at least most of the rage powers as if they were 8th level at least some of the time- I have to check that for balance. Remember that there is already a feat to gain an extra rage power, and it can be taken multiple times.

Pathfinder is not as dicked up as 3.X, so I don't feel the need to make custom charts, or port over, for instance, my custom sorcerer or fighter changes, as both of those guys have new stuff.

Druids are pretty great. I don't think I've ever had a player regret playing a druid. Except for that one guy who kept casting produce trivial minor action-inefficient flame.

As another note, we are probably using the barbarian from Pathfinder Unchained. If you actually want to play a barbarian and want the core barbarian, now is the time to speak up. I won't allow them both, and I will build NPCs off of whichever one we are using. I believe the newer one to be a better class design, and easier to run, but if you have a hardon for the core one, I'd be totally fine having him be the Only Girl In The World, as barbarian builds go. The only unchained class I'm sure I want to use over the original is the summoner, and the only one of any of the unchained guys I'd consider allowing into the world next to the core one is the monk.

Edit: If you *think* you want to play a barbarian, say you want core, and then decide "fuck barbarian", that's completely fine too. The difference to me is very minor.

@Zem: Your potential paladin sounds super interesting. Make sure you decide on a favorite grandchild so I can inform an evil wizard. The rogue is interesting too, but with a character like that, the details you flesh it out with will be the bigger choice. I don't have an eta for a campaign document yet, which would help with either case.

Well, I'm sure if I pick a rogue I'll come up with something more interesting. But rogues are tricky because they... well, it is difficult to imagine one who is anything other than a poor kid from the city who got involved with the wrong crowd.

Hm.... Ok, actually, I can readily imagine a wealthy kid from the city who started stealing shit because it was fun. I kind of like that idea.

I'm definitely down to paladin, cleric, or rogue. Or druid. I can never rule out druid.

I decided I couldn't use the savage elf and tower elf templates for thy Ilyan (gray elves) and the wood elves. I did those two a little bit custom instead.